Members Jettech Posted December 11, 2007 Members Share Posted December 11, 2007 Looking for a little advice:Situation - I play a solo gig on the taco circuit in restaurants where the volume level and floor space are tightly constrained. I recently put away my Fender Acoustic/Electric guitar and bought a Godin A6 Ultra with a Piezo pickup under the bridge and a humbucker in the neck position. Problem - I can get a good acoustic sound from the piezo after running thru a Digitech Vocalist 4 and out of my pedalboard (Boss chorus, EQ, and Tube Screamer) straight to the PA. However, the sound from the humbucker is sickly and anemic. It sounds great when I run it through a 15 watt tube amp, but I don't have the real estate and can't afford the extra volume. Question - how can I get a good (doesn't have to be great) electric guitar tone using my existing pedals (plus a Boss DS1) going straight to the PA? What I'm hoping for is something I can fit on my pedalboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted December 12, 2007 Members Share Posted December 12, 2007 Probably anything that has some sort of amp emulation. I get a really good sound going directly into the PA with my Vox ToneLab pedalboard. I don't do this very often. That's because I get a really *great* sound going from my ToneLab to my Carr Rambler. But it's nice to know that if I don't have the amp, I still have choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted December 12, 2007 Members Share Posted December 12, 2007 Yes, something with speaker emulation. I've used an old Hughes & Kettner Red Box for years when direct recording. Santa Claus is bringing me some Digitech pedals with cabinet modeling, and I'll be interested to hear that through some PA's when I hit the open mic circuit with a strat, a distortion box, a chorus pedal, and a loop station (Richard Thompson eat your heart out. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jettech Posted December 13, 2007 Author Members Share Posted December 13, 2007 Billster, I'm currently using the Behringer Ultra-G GI100 DI Box with amp emulation. It makes things better, but the tone is still pretty brittle. Is the H&K Red Box that much better? What Digitech pedals are you looking at? The RP series? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted December 14, 2007 Members Share Posted December 14, 2007 Not familiar with the behringer. The Red Box made a huge difference in my recorded sound. Huge. I'm getting the Digitech "factory" pedals - distortion and chorus. They each have modeling modes to emulate various popular stompboxes like the Ibanez Tube Screamer, Boss Metal Zone, TC Electronic Chorus+Flange, and so on and so forth. I'll have user reviews come January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MDLMUSIC Posted December 14, 2007 Members Share Posted December 14, 2007 I often use the Digitech RP250 when playing a small gig, going direct to the PA. For more high volume ones I run my RP50 into a Peavey Special 130. Tried using the RP50 into the PA at a Christmas party Tuesday night. It was horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members scud133 Posted December 14, 2007 Members Share Posted December 14, 2007 Can you go from a Pod X3 Live straight to the sound board? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members D Charles Posted December 14, 2007 Members Share Posted December 14, 2007 Your pedals are designed to go into a guitar amp. They'll never sound right straight into a PA. You really need to pick up a pedal board as it's arse end will have amp and speaker emulation and give you the right tone and level to interface with the mixer. I used a Cream Machine for lead into PA at one time and later a Boss all in one. Nothing sounds like an amp (although the Cream Machine comes close for overdrive sounds), but you can get a useable tone out of the emulator/modelers and they're compact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jettech Posted December 14, 2007 Author Members Share Posted December 14, 2007 I'm currently experimenting with a friend's GT8, but I was hoping not to incur the expense of a large multi effects processor while my pedal collection gathers dust. Has anybody tried adding something like the "Art Tube MP" to the end of their pedal chain and then go direct to the PA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members stevethompson Posted December 18, 2007 Members Share Posted December 18, 2007 I used a classic Tech-21 SansAmp for quite a while, it sounded great - it can emulate a few different amplifiers reasonably well. Evidently they're out of production right now but you should be able to snag one used somewhere - http://www.tech21nyc.com/classic.html - good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cooterbrown Posted December 19, 2007 Members Share Posted December 19, 2007 Question - how can I get a good (doesn't have to be great) electric guitar tone using my existing pedals (plus a Boss DS1) going straight to the PA? What I'm hoping for is something I can fit on my pedalboard. How bout a Zvex Nanoamp? (shown actual size!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted December 19, 2007 Members Share Posted December 19, 2007 That Z-Vex thing is supposed to be really cool, but not for D.I. situations. Read the product page: For best results, use with a 16 ohm (or 8 ohm) cabinet. I prefer a Marshall/Orange 4X12 or a Vox extension cabinet, but try anything you like. The key problem with D.I. guitar is that the characteristic tone of electric guitar is defined by the limited range of the speakers in a guitar amp. A full-frequency sound system has too much high end to allow a tolerable electric guitar sound. This is especially true with overdrive sounds, unless you like the sound of insects flying into your ear canal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cooterbrown Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 That Z-Vex thing is supposed to be really cool, but not for D.I. situations. Read the product page:The key problem with D.I. guitar is that the characteristic tone of electric guitar is defined by the limited range of the speakers in a guitar amp. A full-frequency sound system has too much high end to allow a tolerable electric guitar sound. This is especially true with overdrive sounds, unless you like the sound of insects flying into your ear canal. He could crank the Zvex into a Hot Plate, or some other dummy load, then line it into the PA, with the appropriate EQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 Cooter, it's not the load, it's the limitations of the speakers themselves. You need some pretty drastic parametric EQ to match the response curve of a Celestion guitar speaker. It's a total PITA, which is why I went to the Red Box long ago. I'm curious to see how the Digitech things work out, because I'll be doing essentially the same thing as Jet. MDL: Does the the RP50 have cabinet emulation modes? I'm not familiar with that piece since I wasn't shopping for multi-fx, just some stompboxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 For more high volume ones I run my RP50 into a Peavey Special 130. Tried using the RP50 into the PA at a Christmas party Tuesday night. It was horrible. OK, here's the manual (Link in pdf) Page 20: Global Cabinet Modeling The RP50 includes cabinet modeling that can be enabled on all presets when running it into a mixer, recording device, or when using it with headphones. This feature emulates a speaker cabinet connected to each of the amp models in all presets. Each amp model has a specific cabinet model that optimizes its sound when using the RP50 in this manner. To enable Cabinet Modeling: 1. Press and hold the drums button when applying power to the RP50. Wait until the display reads Cabinet On. Release the Drums button. Cabinet Modeling is now enabled for all amp models in all presets. The following lists what cabinet accompanies each model: b1-b9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Will Chen Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 The newest Digi RP series (150,250,350) are compact and sound good direct. If you really want to keep using your pedals, you could simply set the unit for a clean sound like a Twin and feed your pedals into it. However, the units model most of the pedals you use and I did a side by side comparison with a TS9, DS1, and RAT and they really did an excellent job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Inazone Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 I'm currently experimenting with a friend's GT8, but I was hoping not to incur the expense of a large multi effects processor while my pedal collection gathers dust. Has anybody tried adding something like the "Art Tube MP" to the end of their pedal chain and then go direct to the PA? I have tried the ART Tube MP running straight to the board for direct-recording purposes, and it is an improvement, but a tube-based parametric EQ is better in my experience. I've used the ART Tube EQ in my live pedal rig (through mic'd cabs) for fattening up my guitar tone when the venue PA thins it out too much, and the Tube Channel in my recording rig. Running either unit direct is quite effective, but it is necessary to adjust the input and output gain controls very carefully to avoid excess noise. The Tube EQ is a half-space unit that would fit on your pedalboard no problem, but I have found the ART's controls and internal construction to be a little fragile if moved around much. For this reason, I switched to an Electro-Harmonix Tube EQ pedal instead, as it seems a bit more rugged and is of course meant to be stepped on. It is a much more guitar-specific device and sounds wonderful without much noise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hard Truth Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 I guess they're not considered cool anymore, but your application is exactly what the Pod is designed for. Your results might improve if you run its output into a direct box instead of directly into a PA. Some models of the Pod have a low impedance out, so you wouldn't need the direct box. Before spending the money on a direct box, I recommend borrowing one to see if it makes a worthwhile difference. Also, I would not rule out using a small guitar amp with tube amp modelling built in. I'm very happy with my Vox DA5 amp. With a modelling amp, you could skip bringing the effects pedals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members backtoblue Posted December 21, 2007 Members Share Posted December 21, 2007 I'm currently experimenting with a friend's GT8, but I was hoping not to incur the expense of a large multi effects processor while my pedal collection gathers dust. Has anybody tried adding something like the "Art Tube MP" to the end of their pedal chain and then go direct to the PA? You could do both! I run by Boss GT-8 with a Tube MP in the 8's effects loop, right after the preamps. It really make the emulators come alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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