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Need a shower and debrief. Just went to a very, very dark place.


Huh?

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People, what is up over at the Political Party sub-Forum? I just went over there and man, that place is filled with so much hatred, bigotry, racism....... I swear, I don't think I can go back.......it is how I envision purgatory...... there is so much underlying evil there.

 

I went there looking for political discussion hoping to find people like me who want to suss out what is good and bad for this great country. I'm worried for the US of A, so seeing it said that anything goes kinda at PP, I was looking forward to at least somewhat controlled political discussion and debate, after reading Craig's rules.

 

Wow!!!! I was not prepared for what I found.

 

There is no chance for civil discussion there, none whatsoever. At least, that is how it looks to me. Seriously, I don't know if I can go back to give the place a little time to grow on me......I also noticed none of you guys post over there.

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People, what is up over at the Political Party sub-Forum? I just went over there and man, that place is filled with so much hatred, bigotry, racism....... I swear, I don't think I can go back.......it is how I envision purgatory...... there is so much underlying evil there.


I went there looking for political discussion hoping to find people like me who want to suss out what is good and bad for this great country. I'm worried for the US of A, so seeing it said that anything goes kinda at PP, I was looking forward to at least
somewhat
controlled political discussion and debate, after reading Craig's rules.


Wow!!!! I was not prepared for what I found.


There is no chance for civil discussion there, none whatsoever. At least, that is how it looks to me. Seriously, I don't know if I can go back to give the place a little time to grow on me......I also noticed none of you guys post over there.

 

 

Used to be long time back, that there was no separate forum for the political troglodytes - now that was a mess, 'cause SSS would get derailed regularly by the offal-flinging crowd. So a separate forum was created as a containment cage - the plan has worked for the most part.

 

Amazing what a little anonymity will bring out in certain folks...surely a great measure of it is just guys having a perverse sort of fun trying to get a rise out of anyone who will take the bait....

 

nat whilk ii

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Yeah I kinda got that but holy {censored} it is like a snarling, vicious cage fighting free for all in there. Blood and fur flying as the animals tear each other to pieces. I mean.....posts like if you knew you were having a certain kind of baby would you abort it.....others slamming different ethnicities, religious groups, political ideals etc.

 

There is nothing really productive going on from what I can see.

 

But as soon as I saw none of the people I like from SSS were over there, it dawned on me that it was a way to isolate the haters and put them all in one place, let them kill each other.....LOL..."self moderating".

 

One thing is for sure, I just cannot see how any of them spewing hatred and verbal diarrhea can be serious musicians, because I don't see how one can be so creative on one hand and so hateful and destructive on the other.

 

That's why I don't want to hang. I can mix it up, not afraid, I just don't need to be around that stuff. So much anger.

 

Dunn, maybe I just showed up at a bad time, but I doubt it.

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Yes Ed A I could see the posts that were interesting and all but it doesn't take long that someone comes in with bad intent and it get's mean spirited. I suppose I am just at a point in my that I don't need that. I am trying to chill I guess. Not much chill in there......lotsa flames.

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I've never posted there much. I tried, but gave up on PP long time ago. It's not for the serious, fair-minded individual looking for intelligent political or current issues discussion. Many look at it as harmless, but IMO using other human beings as punching bags is never harmless. It builds ill will, which comes out in other areas of a persons life. People in forums like that are exercising something and that something like any something gets stronger and more dominant in a persons behavior. In this case the regulars there are becoming experts in mean and nasty.

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I just cannot see how any of them spewing hatred and verbal diarrhea can be serious musicians, because I don't see how one can be so creative on one hand and so hateful and destructive on the other.

 

 

Really? There's lots of hateful music out there.

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I also noticed none of you guys post over there.

 

 

Used to.

 

To my way of thinking, it fills the unpleasant but necessary role of giving all that negativity and bad feeling a place to go -- and helps keep it out of the other forums.

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That's why I'm heavily active in only local politics. If you want to get things done on a community level, if you work it right, it can be done in weeks, days even. And best of all, everyone has more or less the same concerns. I've been organizing my local community for the past 15 years and I've seen gay people and Born-again Christians volunteer to clean up the streets together. I've seen self-professed anarchists and active Republicans cooperate on keeping the neighborhood safe. Of course, you'll NEVER see those things happen on a national/global level, and that's precisely why nothing ever gets done!

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I go there from time to time, wield a ban hammer, get a lot of crap because I don't have a magic wand to keep banned people from returning, and move on. There are a couple interesting aspects, though.

 

You can graph trends just by assessing the direction of the posts. People are really freaked out right now - it really does seem like there's massive, global insanity and a lack of civility (bombing Tripoli and assassinating foreign leaders with no judge or jury? Really?) and so the HCPP has...massive, global insanity and a lack of civility. People who don't have jobs don't know when they'll ever find one, and people who have them don't know if they'll have them next week. Meanwhile, you don't want to know what Fukushima is doing to this planet. You really don't. And the BP oil spill didn't just go away...

 

When people are afraid, they look for scapegoats and lash out. I've banned quite a few people for racist and anti-Semitic comments, but there's a fine line...there are people who hate Obama's policies because he's black, and there are people who hate his policies because they hate his policies. The Israel thing is dicey, too, because some people use anti-Israel diatribes as an excuse for anti-Semitism, but then there are plenty of religious Jews who are very much opposed to the actions of the government and I can guarantee it's not because they're anti-Semitic.

 

I mostly leave things alone there because, well, freedom of speech and all that. Sometimes it's better to give people enough rope to hang themselves. But, I will say I've had to go there more recently and delete things, warn people, etc. People are really, really upright, and the HCPP reflects that.

 

There is no truth to the rumor that the HCPP is done as a favor to the NSA so they can get a handle on current trends. :)

 

BTW at its best, which hasn't happened that much lately, the HCPP has two really redeeming features. First, some of the people who post there have a sense of humor that represents a clear and present danger to anyone drinking anything while reading. Second, sometimes you can learn things you won't find in the mainstream media - links to reputable, but little-known, sources. I've been amazed at how many times a discussion will be several days old before the rest of the world picks up on the topic.

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That's why I'm heavily active in only
local
politics. If you want to get things done on a community level, if you work it right, it can be done in weeks, days even. And best of all, everyone has more or less the same concerns. I've been organizing my local community for the past 15 years and I've seen gay people and Born-again Christians volunteer to clean up the streets together. I've seen self-professed anarchists and active Republicans cooperate on keeping the neighborhood safe. Of course, you'll NEVER see those things happen on a national/global level, and that's precisely why nothing ever gets done!

 

 

That's a really interesting comment. Kinda jives to an extent with the "anonymity breeds contemptible behavior" much-observed phenomenon.

 

"Diversity" seems at first glance like a softie-liberal-weenie sort of concern, but you know, in the big scheme of things, it's a life and death matter.

 

nat whilk ii

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(bombing Tripoli and assassinating foreign leaders with no judge or jury? Really?)

 

 

Or waging a secret covert war in Yemen without a declaration from Congress and without the knowledge of the American people?

 

Not brown nosing here, but you do a truly remarkable "job" as a moderator Craig ....giving people, who most other mods would feel really don't deserve it, a lot of leeway......allowing the pressure cooker to let off steam etc and most of all for having a very even keel and seeing more than one side to any situation.....seeing the good first rather than the bad.

 

There are not too many mods like that out there I reckon, I don't know of any.

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Not brown nosing here, but you do a truly remarkable "job" as a moderator Craig ....giving people, who most other mods would feel really don't deserve it, a lot of leeway......allowing the pressure cooker to let off steam etc and most of all for having a very even keel and seeing more than one side to any situation.....seeing the good first rather than the bad.

 

Come on, is there anyone on Earth who actually hates Craig Anderton? If there is, they don't really exist. :)

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I posted over there a few times trying to make some coherent civil discussion. Just couldnt hack the wackos. No matter what position you'd take, Left Right or Center you get chewed up just for posting. No welcome to the disccussion, nice to have you type deal. I think many are a bunch of kids who have zero real life experiences yet. When you have some work experience, you learn that religion and politics discussions are not tolerated in a normal work enviornments. You have to get along with coworkers and it makes people tolerant and respectful for others beliefs because you have no choice if you want to keep your job.

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I think many are a bunch of kids who have zero real life experiences yet. When you have some work experience, you learn that religion and politics discussions are not tolerated in a normal work enviornments. You have to get along with coworkers and it makes people tolerant and respectful for others beliefs because you have no choice if you want to keep your job.

 

People freely speaking their mind versus people forced to get along under threat of their livelihood... doesn't sound like a positive argument for civility to me.

 

I think the OP is right... the Political Party is a dark place, but that's because it reflects the reality of human nature. A lot of people can't stomach that or don't want to constantly be reminded of that. But it's out there, and it's affecting all of our lives, and pretending like it doesn't exist, or that you're above it all... that's not going to make a positive difference in the long run.

 

Anyway Who, too bad your entire existence on the Political Party consisted of a few posts in a thread about Congressman Weiner. There's a huge amount of noise in the signal over there (like all the Weiner threads) and it takes some time to cut through it.

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i dont go there because it is pointless to argue with people that are not smart enough to be able to change their minds. i dont think anyne there really wants to change or understand anything, they just want to argue pointlessly, and i can do that at home or at work if i want to.

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I think many are a bunch of kids who have zero real life experiences yet.

 

 

I really hope so. It makes sense. I'd be really disturbed if I felt it was serious adults posting {censored} like "If they could detect homosexuality before birth, would you abort your child? or "Here are 3 reasons why israel should not exist"..... "Awesome news for fans of abortion"...... "Why won't God heal amputees?"

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It's really not that bad.

 

:eek:

 

Well, I guess you have to figure out which threads you are going to open....and maybe people who have hung there a long time have become used to how certain people respond and all....... so yeah, you are probably right in the sense I am just seeing the latest posts, and maybe it is a particularly sick time right now.

 

I'm no prude, trust me.......I have had my party days for many a good few years before I was able to put that behind me..... so I have seen and lived some dark times. And at work, the humor can get pretty sick, perverted and gross sometimes.

 

But nothing like what I have seen in there. With us it's just between a contained group. You'd shuddup right quick if someone out of the group walked by.

 

In there, it is for the whole world to see. You must figure somebody is going to feel hurt, deeply insulted or offended.

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i dont go there because it is pointless to argue with people that are not smart enough to be able to change their minds. i dont think anyne there really wants to change or understand anything, they just want to argue pointlessly, and i can do that at home or at work if i want to.

 

 

I will admit that one reason why I go there is because I'm either stupid, arrogant, or naive enough to think I can make a difference. There was one poster there who was a total hardcore racist. I tried to engage him in a conversation but there was no hope of him ever changing his polluting of the forum, so I perma-banned him.

 

OTOH there was another racist who dismissed all of Africa as a hellhole. I engaged him in a conversation, pointed out some of the African success stories, noted that other than China and India some of the fastest-growing economies right now are African, etc. etc. I included links to info about these countries. He actually had an open enough mind to listen to what I said and changed his mind to recognize that it was incorrect to think all of Africa is the same. It isn't.

 

I had also seen comments in there about how there couldn't possibly have been six million Jews killed in the Holocaust because the math just didn't add up. On the face of it, that seems plausible - after all there were only 750,000 Jews in Germany at the start of WWII, and that alone is a lot of people to murder. So despite always accepting the figures, I thought I'd do some research and found that actually, it was WORSE than commonly believed. Taking other ethnic and national groups into account, there were more like eleven million people killed. This happened over a period of 12 years at dozens of camps, and not all deaths were in the camps - there were mass open-air shootings of Poles and Russians. As to the numbers, it seems the Nazis were excellent record-keepers; the numbers aren't estimates. Besides, Adolf Eichmann, who was the architect of the "final solution," said they murdered six million Jews...and he should know.

 

So, I presented this material without any editorializing in the context of simply presenting facts so people could be better educated. Most will probably not read it. Some will, and some will be armed with valid information should they run into someone who can't believe a civilization could sink so low. It can, and did. We need to understand we're dealing not just with an historical fact from the past, but a warning about the future.

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