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  • Isn't It A Crying Shame...

    ...that Anderton's Pro Reviews forum is still MIA on this site? 

    (I'm posting this here because Craig said he'd still read/post to this forum after his move to Gibson. Maybe he can convince GC/HC to do whatever work is required to restore the Pro Reviews forum, at least in read-only form. Otherwise everything Craig and others wrote about the reviewed products, some of which are sold by GC, is wasted.)

     


  • #2

    I don't know, the dude is a pretty busy guy; I can't fault him.  I'd wager he has his hands full, between here, Electronics Musician, and the dozens of other things he's constantly juggling.

    I always valued his writings and reviews. He knows how to write English well, to use it as a tool to communicate, and does not output BS.   That is a rare combination of good assets.

    For me, reviews are a nice way to keep tabs on the state of the art, but I have never relied on them for a buying decision.  What good would that be?  So I could blame the reviewer if I don't end up liking the product? That's a 'victim mentality'.

    I take more responsibility for my actions than that.  I research stuff on my own, I try it out, I look at the mechanical design, I decide if it is something that helps me make music well.  It has worked out very well - - reviews are more like a tip than a recommendation, in my eyes.

    Comment


    • MikeRivers
      MikeRivers commented
      Editing a comment

      It seems to me that the Pro Reviews used to be pretty easy to find, and then they became difficult to find. I haven't seen one in a while.


      I was hoping that perhaps with Craig having a full time real job, I might get a crack at doing a Pro Review now and then. [cue the circling buzzards]. 


    • AlenK
      AlenK commented
      Editing a comment

      philbo wrote:

      For me, reviews are a nice way to keep tabs on the state of the art, but I have never relied on them for a buying decision.  What good would that be?  So I could blame the reviewer if I don't end up liking the product? That's a 'victim mentality'.

      I hear you and agree. We have to take personal responsibility for our choices. Still, reviews, whether amateur or professional, are pieces of information that can, when combined with other pieces of information, help us narrow our selection whan we're looking for something. For example, if you need a piece of gear to do a particular thing in a particular way and you read in several reviews that something you were considering can't, chances are it really can't and you should look at something else.


  • #3

    AlenK wrote:

    ...that Anderton's Pro Reviews forum is still MIA on this site? 



     


    There are so many shames here at the moment.  I think the larger shame is that the USER reviews are missing, as those were one of the three anchors that made the original HC so popular (forums, user reviews, tabs).  All three of those are now essentially gone.


    USER reviews are SO much more valuable than pro reviews to the regular musician because you get the view of the guy on the street straight and unvarnished, with no taint of suspicion that when a manufacturer pays for something he's gonna want it to be positive.  And yes, Craig, I know you're an honest guy and tell it like it is, but the "taint" is still there and perception is a fair chunk of reality.


    Also, a Pro Review is usually the impression formed after some hours of tinkering with the device, user reviews are often opinions forged after playing actual shows, maybe months or years of experience actually using the thing at gigs.


    Example.  I recently bought a Rocktron Velocity power amp after reading the hype on MF that it's solid, clean power in a small package, guitarist friendly.   Had the user reviews been working here I'd have read all the ones on that device and likely heard someone say, "This thing is ANYTHING but clean power, the REACTANCE knob should be relabled MUD and the DEFINITION knob should be relabled HARSHNESS.  On the plus side, if you like the SAG of an old tube amp with a tube rectifier where the voltage slew can't keep up with the transient attack of clean guitar, then this is definitely the solid state amp you've been looking for."


    And if I hadn't found that in the User Reviews, I'd have surely added it myself.


    So what's the big deal, right?  Just return the thing to MF, right?  Well, things have changed there.  If something is defective, you get to return it on their dime and if you didn't trash it you get a full refund.  BUT.... if it's not what you wanted, there's a restocking fee now and the return postage is on you.


    User reviews were very important, and Pro Reviews in no way replace them as the sheer number of user reviews on a popular product offer all possible takes on a product.  They're sorely missed, and the visitation stats on this website reflect that, I believe.


    FWIW, the part of the Pro Reviews that I did like was the use of media (pics, clips, video) to show the features in a way that text sometimes can't.


    Terry D.

    Telling Stories releases 2nd CD, see our WEBSITE! Please check out my GROUPIE STORY and Tales from the Road.

    Comment


    • Anderton
      Anderton commented
      Editing a comment

      MrKnobs wrote:


      AlenK wrote:

      ...that Anderton's Pro Reviews forum is still MIA on this site? 



       


      There are so many shames here at the moment.  I think the larger shame is that the USER reviews are missing, as those were one of the three anchors that made the original HC so popular (forums, user reviews, tabs).  All three of those are now essentially gone.


      USER reviews are SO much more valuable than pro reviews to the regular musician because you get the view of the guy on the street straight and unvarnished, with no taint of suspicion that when a manufacturer pays for something he's gonna want it to be positive.  And yes, Craig, I know you're an honest guy and tell it like it is, but the "taint" is still there and perception is a fair chunk of reality.




      Well, agreed 100% about the need for user reviews. I tried to get the original ones that Jive apparently tossed out back, but that went nowhere. The user reviews will come back, although I don't know when...I'm not as close to the action as I used to be, so Phil or Dendy might have a better idea.


      But you're missing the point about pro reviews. They DO incorporate the view of the guy on the street, that's the whole point - interaction. One big advantage of the pro review is that the view of the guy on the street doesn't exist in isolation. There's often misinformation in user reviews, because there are no checks and balances. But that's far less likely in a pro review because other users, the moderator, and the manufacturer are all paying attention. No one can say something is great if it sucks, but conversely, no one can say something sucks if it's great, and they just haven't read the manual or installed the update.


      And, pro reviews do get updated. There was a situation with a Sonar pro review where I found a bug, Cakewalk was able to repeat it, they fixed it, and a couple weeks later there was a patch. That would never happen with a user review.


      So, all the reviews have their purposes. As to manufacturers wanting something to be positive, they really don't have any say in the matter. No posts have ever been removed from a pro review simply because they were negative. But what this DOES mean is that only manufacturers who have a whole lotta confidence in their products want pro reviews, which is why - with a few notable exceptions - the reactions from users to the products have generally been positive.


    • RoadRanger
      RoadRanger commented
      Editing a comment

      MrKnobs wrote:

      [...] the three anchors that made the original HC so popular (forums, user reviews, tabs).  All three of those are now essentially gone.

      I really miss the Musician Wanted/Available Section, last seen in April 2010 :

      http://web.archive.org/web/20100409001124/http://www.harmony-central.com/cgi-bin/musician-query.pl


  • #4
    Sorry the pro reviews was stupid. You've made your mark here in a bad way. Have fun at Gibson.

    Comment


    • guido61
      guido61 commented
      Editing a comment

      I always viewed the difference between the Pro and User reviews as this:

      Pro Reviews:  new, straight-outta-the-box products that haven't yet had time to be street or gig tested that are 'taken apart' and analysized by people with a lot of experience with various similar products who can make comparsions.

      User Reviews: great for those street/gig experience reviews of older products by people who use them in real-life situations. 

      Both were very useful and both are now gone. 


    • Anderton
      Anderton commented
      Editing a comment

      lazaraga wrote:
      Sorry the pro reviews was stupid. You've made your mark here in a bad way. Have fun at Gibson.

      Well, it's certainly hard to argue with such a thoughtful, detailed critique - you've certainly exposed the concept's weaknesses in a clear and logical fashion. However, I doubt the people who pushed many individual pro reviews into the quarter-million and half-million views range would agree with you.


      As to making my mark here, that ended in 2010 when the powers that be stopped listening to me, the rest of the staff, and the community. I think you'll find that prior to that, when I and the rest of the editorial staff had free rein, HC was doing just fine.


      And yes, I'm having much fun at Gibson .png" border="0" alt=":smileyhappy:" title="Smiley Happy" />  And part of that is because I don't have to deal with the kind of unreasoned negativity that people like you bring to forums, or get blamed for things I was fighting against because others were more than happy to throw me, as the most visible person in HC, under the bus.


      HC still has a fantastic editorial team that truly understands the community. If they're just left alone to do what they do best, HC will rebound and return to what made it special in the first place.


  • #5

    So at this late date there's some sort of reason to debate whether the term "Pro Review" was a good title and/or concept???   They got tons of hits and thoughtful responses and were the most informative reviews you could find by any measure.

     

    User reviews, as we all know, are utterly hit or miss potluck sort of commentary.  They can be useful if you know how to filter them and you get lucky.  They are a far cry from the extended look at a bit of kit by a knowledgeable, fair-minded reviewer in dialog with the frickin' manufacturer and users at all levels from 60s-vintage pros to the pinkest newbies.

     

    There's nothing to debate here.  No, clearly some folks in an office somewhere have misgivings about such an "archaic" and unTwitter-like venue as the Pro Reviews were.   Too much information I suppose is bad for the buzz???  

     

    nat whilk ii 

     

     

     

    Comment


    • Iamthesky
      Iamthesky commented
      Editing a comment

      And the reviews are back, and navigation improved with cascading menus.

      Nice. :heart:









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