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  • #16






    Quote Originally Posted by Goobers
    View Post



    Neither Finale nor Sibelius have great corporate support, so the software suffers. Not enough money in it I guess




    You are right. Due to my information Finale users don't have support. Sibelius users have to purchase support for additional $100 - that is strange for such expensive software.
    Music Notation Software - Maestro Composer
    Music Scanning Software - SharpEye, PhotoScore, SmartScore

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    • #17






      Quote Originally Posted by JamesGV
      View Post

      You are right. Due to my information Finale users don't have support. Sibelius users have to purchase support for additional $100 - that is strange for such expensive software.




      I think we're going to see more of that. Before PCs, that's how all software was - you purchased a license and support separately. Music software is getting so fully-featured (the polite term for "bloated but they can sell the same thing to everybody") so there really isn't much reason for anyone to buy an upgrade, and they're they're not making money from their users by giving free updates forever.



      Once the bugs are fixed and you've figured out how to work the program, you probably don't need any more support or new features that come with a newer version, but you might need "support" when you get a new computer or update your operating system. That's a problem that you created, not the software manufacturer, so you pay for it as "support." Either you pay as you go and get a new version when you need it, or you pay for the new version if or when you need it.
      --
      "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
      Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

      Comment


      • #18






        Quote Originally Posted by JamesGV
        View Post

        You are right. Due to my information Finale users don't have support. Sibelius users have to purchase support for additional $100 - that is strange for such expensive software.




        that's another good point, but I was actually making a more fundamental point - that the software suffers because the companies themselves aren't strong.



        whatever money the companies make from notation software, it's not enough to pay for developing, debugging, and updating it properly.
        I will be banned soon, so don't get too attached.

        Comment


        • #19
          After reading this thread, it confirms some of my initial thoughts about Finale which I`ve been using sporadically for about a year now and that is that its poorly written software. There are a lot of quirky things the program does which leave me completely shaking my head at times. Granted, no software is perfect but there are "features" in Finale that have me wondering who in the world would use them. For example, I don`t need 240 different fonts... just give me three options: the maestro font, the jazz font and the handwritten font. I don`t need the other junk. Then there are these endless options... lets just cut the nonsense and get to it.



          Some of its also the learning curve, which I`m pretty impatient to sit there and go through the tutorials which thankfully there is plenty of. I`ve been pretty good about it, I have watched and read a lot of it but theres just so darn much info to learn, I feel like I should get a degree when I actually learn all of it.

          Comment


          • #20






            Quote Originally Posted by JamesGV
            View Post

            What do you think what is the best music notation software?

            1. What software you use(know)?

            2. How long you use it?

            3. What you do with your software?

            4. What you line/dislike (need) in music notation software?




            JamesGV,



            I apologize for the rant... I never answered your questions...



            1. Finale 2012

            2. It`ll be a year this January

            3. Most to notate my own Church compositions

            4. Truthfully, I`m still trying to like the product. I know there are other options out there and I did my homework before investing in Finale. Finale seemed to be the most professional from the crop. Also, some musicians and composers I highly respect use it so that pretty much sealed the deal. I really dislike all the crazy amount of options in Finale. I also dislike all the buttons and floating windows. I`m more of a keep everything in one window and within arms reach type of guy. Searching for features in windows and drop downs is just way too much. Granted, all software these days is like this but when it comes time to notate, I don`t want to have to search for 5 minutes to try to insert an upbeat measure at the beginning of the piece.



            Also, the playback feature in Finale is archaic. Honestly, I hate to say this because its overly generalizing but Finale is a bit PC oriented for me. I think an Apple developer needs to come in and do it right. Just my $0.02

            Comment


            • #21






              Quote Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley
              View Post

              After reading this thread, it confirms some of my initial thoughts about Finale which I`ve been using sporadically for about a year now and that is that its poorly written software. There are a lot of quirky things the program does which leave me completely shaking my head at times. Granted, no software is perfect but there are "features" in Finale that have me wondering who in the world would use them. For example, I don`t need 240 different fonts... just give me three options: the maestro font, the jazz font and the handwritten font. I don`t need the other junk. Then there are these endless options... lets just cut the nonsense and get to it.



              Some of its also the learning curve, which I`m pretty impatient to sit there and go through the tutorials which thankfully there is plenty of. I`ve been pretty good about it, I have watched and read a lot of it but theres just so darn much info to learn, I feel like I should get a degree when I actually learn all of it.




              one of the problems with Finale (and Sibelius I guess) is that they try to be all things to all people. And the coding just isn't elegant. So they wind up being Franken-programs, just constantly adding features and modules without ever neatening things up.



              So they get bloated and quirky and inconsistent.



              It would be nice if Finale had a lot of money and could rewrite its **************** from scratch.
              I will be banned soon, so don't get too attached.

              Comment


              • #22






                Quote Originally Posted by Goobers
                View Post

                one of the problems with Finale (and Sibelius I guess) is that they try to be all things to all people. And the coding just isn't elegant. So they wind up being Franken-programs, just constantly adding features and modules without ever neatening things up.



                So they get bloated and quirky and inconsistent.



                It would be nice if Finale had a lot of money and could rewrite its **************** from scratch.




                Well said. Maybe one of these days we`ll get lucky and Apple will buy out Finale... one can dream...

                Comment


                • #23






                  Quote Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley
                  View Post

                  Well said. Maybe one of these days we`ll get lucky and Apple will buy out Finale... one can dream...




                  I hoped for that, especially after Avid bought Sibelius... thinking Apple might be motivated by a "music software arms race."



                  And it would be GREAT to integrate Finale with Logic.



                  At this point, however, it just doesn't seem like there's all that motivation for Apple to buy Finale. Apple wouldn't get that much for its money, and it would come with a lot of headaches.



                  I think the problem is that music notation software costs more money to do right than it can possibly make with its niche customer base.



                  On a gut level, both Finale and Sibelius seem like they've stalled out.



                  Maybe some Paul Allen gazillionaire with a soft spot for music will infuse one of these companies with the millions it needs to develop the next generation notation software.
                  I will be banned soon, so don't get too attached.

                  Comment


                  • #24






                    Quote Originally Posted by Goobers
                    View Post

                    I hoped for that, especially after Avid bought Sibelius... thinking Apple might be motivated by a "music software arms race."



                    And it would be GREAT to integrate Finale with Logic.



                    At this point, however, it just doesn't seem like there's all that motivation for Apple to buy Finale. Apple wouldn't get that much for its money, and it would come with a lot of headaches.



                    I think the problem is that music notation software costs more money to do right than it can possibly make with its niche customer base.



                    On a gut level, both Finale and Sibelius seem like they've stalled out.



                    Maybe some Paul Allen gazillionaire with a soft spot for music will infuse one of these companies with the millions it needs to develop the next generation notation software.




                    I think someone will eventually come along and write software that does a great job and its simple to operate. And it`ll be free. Seems to be the trend these days.

                    Comment


                    • #25






                      Quote Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley
                      View Post

                      Well said. Maybe one of these days we`ll get lucky and Apple will buy out Finale... one can dream...




                      Aaahh, not so fast, I was kind of hoping Roland would buy Finale, and put a subset of the functionality into Sonar..

                      Comment


                      • #26






                        Quote Originally Posted by pbognar
                        View Post

                        Aaahh, not so fast, I was kind of hoping Roland would buy Finale, and put a subset of the functionality into Sonar..




                        If Roland bought Finale, they'd turn it into an awesome program, but produce such incomprehensible manuals that no one would ever figure out how to use it
                        I will be banned soon, so don't get too attached.

                        Comment


                        • #27






                          Quote Originally Posted by Goobers
                          View Post

                          If Roland bought Finale, they'd turn it into an awesome program, but produce such incomprehensible manuals that no one would ever figure out how to use it




                          That`s exactly what I was thinking. Korg and Roland are battling for most unreadable manuals ever written.

                          Comment


                          • #28






                            Quote Originally Posted by Goobers
                            View Post

                            that's another good point, but I was actually making a more fundamental point - that the software suffers because the companies themselves aren't strong.



                            whatever money the companies make from notation software, it's not enough to pay for developing, debugging, and updating it properly.




                            You about Sibelius? I think it was AVID's mistake.

                            The decision dismissing developers undermines the credibility of the Sibelius.

                            There is any news about Sibelius development?
                            Music Notation Software - Maestro Composer
                            Music Scanning Software - SharpEye, PhotoScore, SmartScore

                            Comment


                            • #29






                              Quote Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley
                              View Post

                              After reading this thread, it confirms some of my initial thoughts about Finale which I`ve been using sporadically for about a year now and that is that its poorly written software. There are a lot of quirky things the program does which leave me completely shaking my head at times. Granted, no software is perfect but there are "features" in Finale that have me wondering who in the world would use them. For example, I don`t need 240 different fonts... just give me three options: the maestro font, the jazz font and the handwritten font. I don`t need the other junk. Then there are these endless options... lets just cut the nonsense and get to it.



                              Some of its also the learning curve, which I`m pretty impatient to sit there and go through the tutorials which thankfully there is plenty of. I`ve been pretty good about it, I have watched and read a lot of it but theres just so darn much info to learn, I feel like I should get a degree when I actually learn all of it.




                              I really don't know who needs 240 fonts. If this is correct may be Finale trying to make you dizzy from the numbers, and make you bying it like "coolest" tool?



                              I think Finale powerful software,but even in its basic concepts already have inaccuracies. This flaws are multiplying - it complicates the use of the Finale.
                              Music Notation Software - Maestro Composer
                              Music Scanning Software - SharpEye, PhotoScore, SmartScore

                              Comment


                              • #30






                                Quote Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley
                                View Post

                                JamesGV,



                                I apologize for the rant... I never answered your questions...



                                1. Finale 2012

                                2. It`ll be a year this January

                                3. Most to notate my own Church compositions

                                4. Truthfully, I`m still trying to like the product. I know there are other options out there and I did my homework before investing in Finale. Finale seemed to be the most professional from the crop. Also, some musicians and composers I highly respect use it so that pretty much sealed the deal. I really dislike all the crazy amount of options in Finale. I also dislike all the buttons and floating windows. I`m more of a keep everything in one window and within arms reach type of guy. Searching for features in windows and drop downs is just way too much. Granted, all software these days is like this but when it comes time to notate, I don`t want to have to search for 5 minutes to try to insert an upbeat measure at the beginning of the piece.



                                Also, the playback feature in Finale is archaic. Honestly, I hate to say this because its overly generalizing but Finale is a bit PC oriented for me. I think an Apple developer needs to come in and do it right. Just my $0.02




                                Thank you for detailed answer. About options I agree. About windows and drop-downs I understand you. But how can notation software supports needs of huge number of musicians and be simple to use?
                                Music Notation Software - Maestro Composer
                                Music Scanning Software - SharpEye, PhotoScore, SmartScore

                                Comment













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