Usually Mostly Neither - New lyric. Does it hold up?

[rhino55]

Edit with demo after some forum help:

 

Ended up coming up with a new second half of the second verse that I think works much better than what's sung here

 

http://www.soundclick.com/player/sin...=13059740&q=hi

 

I'm lacking in wit

What I'm packing don't make me brave

I hold my head up high

Cause I don't need to feel ashamed

 

If I could be as smooth as Mark Twain

or as bold as Hemmingway

Then I would win you over

with all the words I say

 

Well, I'm usually mostly neither

but I know who I am

I'm not looking for your acceptance

so tell me why should I give a dam

 

They didn't care about you

and neither do I

if only I was courageous

or maybe kind of sly

 

I'd mask it with bravado

or turn a clever phrase

I'd write something down

and finally I'd get paid

 

Well, I'm usually mostly neither

but I know who I am

I'm not looking for your acceptance

so tell me why should I give a dam

 

One of them drank whiskey

The other drank alot of rum

I think I like 'em both

and I'll go and get me some

 

If could be smooth as Mark Twain

or as bold as Hemmingway

Then I would win you over

with all the words I say

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Original:

 

Here is one I started working on over the weekend while I was doing some yard work. I was initially going to name drop some other authors but when I went and looked at the bookshelf, that started making less sense. Plus, I think there is a neat connection between these two, in that neither gave a sh*t about what other people thought about them. Does this one hold up lyrically? I'm unsure of the chorus? Does it need more information?

 

 

If I could be as smooth as Mark Twain

Or bold as Hemmingway

Then I could win you over

With the words that I say

 

I’m usually mostly neither

Normally I’m pretty shy

When I get around to opening my mouth

It’s always the wrong time

 

I’m not looking for your forgiveness

I know exactly who I am

And I really don’t give a damn

 

I’m not packing the wit but

Sam Clemens would tell you off too

And as far as Papa Hemmingway

No telling what that crazy bastard might do

 

They didn’t care what you think

I don’t either, at least that’s something

You’re luck I’m only me

This probably doesn’t even sting

 

I’m not looking for your forgiveness

I know exactly who I am

And I really don’t give a damn

[LCK]

I like the title and the conceit.

[oldgitplayer]

Agreed that the title and idea are good, but the lyric isn't hanging together strongly.

Maybe develop the title as the chorus hook and set up the last line of each verse so you can launch into 'I'm usually mostly neither''

Something like:

 

V1

If I could be smooth as Mark Twain

Or bold as Hemmingway

Then I could win you over

With the words I say

 

Ch

I’m usually mostly neither

But I know who I am

I’m not looking for forgiveness

So why give a damn?

 

I'm not suggesting this as a resolved lyric - simply as a structural template.

 

The other thing that holds back the flow is that the verses all scan differently.

I think it would help if you establish a common metre.

 

But the priority would be to give the chorus its strength first.

[LCK]

That's good!

[rhino55]

Yeah it is!

 

 

 

I'll have a demo in the morning when I'm not on a phone.

[thehundredthone]

I agree about the need for a metre. Outside of that, the verse chorus interplay is good, but then the second verse and chorus say almost the same thing, more specifically the last four lines before the second chorus. That could do with a little bit of a rework.

[rhino55]

Big thanks to oldgit and LCK. Ya'll gave me some much needed focus on this one. Using 'usually mostly neither' as a hook for the first line of the chorus works pretty well and made the rest of it easy to write.

 

Here is a demo. Ended up coming up with a new second half of the second verse that I think works much better than what's sung here

 

http://www.soundclick.com/player/single_player.cfm?songid=13059740&q=hi

 

I'm lacking in wit

What I'm packing don't make me brave

I hold my head up high

Cause I don't need to feel ashamed

 

If I could be as smooth as Mark Twain

or as bold as Hemmingway

Then I would win you over

with all the words I say

 

Well, I'm usually mostly neither

but I know who I am

I'm not looking for your acceptance

so tell me why should I give a dam

 

They didn't care about you

and neither do I

if only I was courageous

or maybe kind of sly

 

I'd mask it with bravado

or turn a clever phrase

I'd write something down

and finally I'd get paid

 

Well, I'm usually mostly neither

but I know who I am

I'm not looking for your acceptance

so tell me why should I give a dam

 

One of them drank whiskey

The other drank alot of rum

I think I like 'em both

and I'll go and get me some

 

If could be smooth as Mark Twain

or as bold as Hemmingway

Then I would win you over

with all the words I say

 

Well, I'm usually mostly neither

but I know who I am

I'm not looking for your acceptance

so tell me why should I give a dam

[oldgitplayer]

You certainly got the lyric together quick-time.

And so to the demo ……..

The Chorus sounds very similar to the Verses. The verses feel fairly generic to start with. A change of rhythm or greater melodic and harmonic change from the verses could be a good way to go.

[rhino55]

Thanks git, I hear what you're saying. Rhythmically, I'm sort of limited with what I can do on the piano and for whatever reason that's what I played for this one. That um pah sort of rhythm can get tiring. I was hoping it would come across as whimsical and work, but I might need to rethink it.

 

When you say sounds similar are you referring more to the rhythm, the melody, or both?

 

Also do you like acceptance or forgiveness better?

[rhino55]

In other news I let a buddy of mine listen to the demo I did for Crazy Blood and he REALLY liked it.

[oldgitplayer]

Thanks git, I hear what you're saying. Rhythmically, I'm sort of limited with what I can do on the piano and for whatever reason that's what I played for this one. That um pah sort of rhythm can get tiring. I was hoping it would come across as whimsical and work, but I might need to rethink it.

 

When you say sounds similar are you referring more to the rhythm, the melody, or both?

 

Also do you like acceptance or forgiveness better?

 

'Acceptance' works better with the overall subject matter.

 

Given it was just a 1+1 demo, I presumed that the um pah root to 5th bass line would be modified in the final arrangement, so I wasn't referring to that even though it's pretty relentless in the demo. I was referring to the vocal melody following the I IV V progression as sounding generic.

[oldgitplayer]

In other news I let a buddy of mine listen to the demo I did for Crazy Blood and he REALLY liked it.

 

I had forgotten about 'Crazy Blood'.

When I 1st posted the lyric, I had already composed some music for the Chorus. I sent it to Lee because he was looking to do a collaboration. Anyway, he stepped aside when you posted your demo, but he did say that he thought that my chorus was melodically stronger than yours.

So if you are thinking about progressing the song, let me know and I'll have a look for the mp3 and PM it to you. You may like it or maybe not.

 

Later - OK, I've found it.

[rhino55]

HaHa "relentless" I like that. I'll have to revisit that melody and see if I can make it more dynamic. For Crazy Blood, I think Lee needs to do his thing with it. The song is good and deserves a proper treatment, and I'd really like to see where he takes it. By the way, Lee did you get back up and running yet?

 

When I did it, I just really liked the lyric and just took a couple passes at it. That's what came out.

 

Thanks for sending over the chorus. I agree with you and Lee. The chorus melody you came up with is stronger. Hmmm... I had tried working with that before, and didn't have any success, but maybe I can give it another go. At the very least it would be a good exercise.

[mbfrancis]

Wow, I love this a lot. Really great, and I too love the conceit. I'm not sure which version is the most current, but I think my comments apply to all of them.

 

I think the opening verse is incredibly strong. I think the song lags in interest for me in subsequent verses because you try maintain Twain and Hemingway as your "neither" reference. Why don't you introduce two new people in each verse that show other ways in which you're not? Heroes, or singers, or tycoons, or athletes? FIrst you don;t have the words, then the strength, then the money.

 

Also I wish the refrain was less belligerent and more plaintive. More "I wish you'd accept me for who I am" than "I don't care about what you think"...feels fake...clearly you *do* care if you're writing the song, and if you're signing ironically - i.e. swearing you don't give a damn when you really do -- that's not coming through. I wish the chorus was "I usually mostly neither of these things, but xxxxx," with xxxxx being some clever phrase which turns it around, not sure what it is. Kind of like Grace Jones: "I'm not perfect / but I'm perfect for you." That would resonate with me more.

 

Hope this helps.

 

[rhino55]

Thanks Francis. I'm with you on the trying to introduce other people and tried to do that without any success. My problem was I was trying to go with other authors but I didn't even consider athletes or heroes. That's a great idea.

 

To shed some light on why I stayed with these two.

 

Back story: This song is written to a somebody some much as a type of person. It's not clear, and maybe it should be, but the idea was singing to critics. Anyone who releases material from time to time has to send off so many copies to critics and most of them are ignored. It's aggravating, but I get it. They are swamped with material and can't possibly still get to it all. One guy comes to mind in particular. He is the entertainment writer for the local paper. I've never seen him review anything from local people unless they were on a label and the label set it up. Dinosaur. Things are changing get with it!

 

Both Hemmingway and Twain had carefully crafted personas that seemed to be them not giving a dam about what critics thought, but ultimately that was part of their act and they did. At the very least they cared about selling copies of their books so they could get paid.

 

Maybe I need to make that clearer? I don't know.

[mbfrancis]

Back story: This song is written to a somebody some much as a type of person. It's not clear, and maybe it should be, but the idea was singing to critics. Anyone who releases material from time to time has to send off so many copies to critics and most of them are ignored. It's aggravating, but I get it. They are swamped with material and can't possibly still get to it all. One guy comes to mind in particular. He is the entertainment writer for the local paper. I've never seen him review anything from local people unless they were on a label and the label set it up. Dinosaur. Things are changing get with it!

 

Both Hemmingway and Twain had carefully crafted personas that seemed to be them not giving a dam about what critics thought, but ultimately that was part of their act and they did. At the very least they cared about selling copies of their books so they could get paid.

 

Maybe I need to make that clearer? I don't know.

 

Yeah that sounds really convoluted to me, and I didn't get your intent at all. Humbly admitting you're not exceptional at different things but that you love the person and that should be enough (option b) is more broadly relate-able I think than an unknown singer railing at a critic (option a)...why should I care about the latter? My $.02, but this is obviously a personal song, so it's your baby.

 

[rhino55]

Exactly the kind of feed back that makes this forum so valuable.

 

 

 

If I made the title Usually Mostly Neither (A Song for Critics) would that make it clear? And would it work as is?

 

 

 

FWIW, I do think it would have broader appeal going with the option you described, but I don't know if its worth giving up my little snarky flower for it.

[mbfrancis]

I totally get not wanting to give up your "snarky little flower" (that could be the title, ha)....I would try to find ways of making the listener care and relate to you. Dunno, though - in general you lose me when you're railing at critics - if you were famous and had been unfairly treated, or if your record was harshly reviewed but sold a ton, I might be on your side. For an unknown, it's hard to pull it off without sounding bitter. Again, totally get this is personal.