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How Socially Responsible Does The Lyrics To A Song Have To Be?


JoyOfSax

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:confused: I recently finished recording a song I wrote initially for acoustic guitar and it has grown a bit beyond that. I wanted to get your oppinion about the lyrics. The search for some oppinions stems from a response I got from a friend of mine who listened to the song.

 

My friend listened and commented that "this was a very nice sounding, well recorded song; The lyric has a nice flow and the use of metaphor and simile offered a very vivid picture of the subject." Then he said "but you better not try to market that song because you might get sued. Remember what happened to Judas Priest?"

 

Now 2 things will have to happen for you to understand what he meant: 1. You have to listen to the song and 2. You have to read the lyric. Here's the lyric:

 

Die Away Easy-by Archie McLeod III

 

Sometimes it's hard

And I feel like I wanna' give up

And I'm down to the last drop of coffee

In this big old coffe cup

Called life..........

 

And sometimes life just ain't fair

People walking all around you

Like you're not even there

 

And I ain't never felt

Like I really belonged

Folks standing there listening but they never hear your song

And the more you cry out, the more they run and hide

They don't ever want to feel the pain and the hurt that you feel inside

 

Chorus:

 

That's why I wanna' lay down

And die away easy

The damage done and it's all that I can do.

The fight ain't worth the battle and a change for me is due

I wanna' die easy

 

Verse 2

 

Somewhere along the way

I lost touch with myself

Givin' way to the whims and the whines

Of everybody else

That I Love

 

But sometimes that love is not returned

Seems that after so long that's a lesson that I should have learned

 

Chorus

 

Verse 3

 

You say I sound like a cowardly man

Well maybe that's true

You've got your oppinions

(And I've got mine too)

But I've got the power to control my destiny

There ain't nothng you can do about it

It's All up to me

 

Chorus........

 

Now as you read this, remember all things are not as they seem and as readers respond, I'll explain the lyric in more detail. :) The link is listed below to the song. Click on it and take a listen.

 

The Link To "Die Away Easy"-Click On It

 

My question? Do you think the lyric here is socially irresponsible or socially unacceptable? Do you think this lyric may cause someone to harm themself? This song came from a personal experience, yes but I don't want the listener to get the wrong impression or interpretation of the song. Comments? :D

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Dude, how many people will ever realistically hear your song? And of those people, what do you think is the percentage that would actually listen to the lyrics? And of those people, what percentage is going to have such a high regard for you that they decide without other provocation to kill themselves?

 

Maybe they'll do it right there at the open mic night.

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Originally posted by the.aw.hells

Dude, how many people will ever realistically hear your song? And of those people, what do you think is the percentage that would actually listen to the lyrics? And of those people, what percentage is going to have such a high regard for you that they decide without other provocation to kill themselves?


Maybe they'll do it right there at the open mic night.

 

First of all, thanks for the reply. Secondly, what do you consider "realistic"?

right now, my soundclick site "realistically" has had about 53,000 hit's (visits) since Nov. 2003 up to now. I'm not counting the 2002-2003 stats. Aside from being an educator by day, I am a performer who has a rather large regional following and I do a lot of studio work in the Carolinas, Virginia, and the DC area. That alone puts my music before a pretty large audience.

Thirdly, Who would realistically listen to my lyrics? (Refer back to the 2nd point) I am beyond open mic nights so who knows and since people who plan to kill themselves usually don't need a lot of provocation, I still don't know whether or not I want any of my words to remotely a source of motivation for them at all.

 

:rolleyes:

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If you're going to make artistic decisions based on whether or not you might get sued over the "social responsibility" of your lyrics, then you're putting a leash on your creativity that will become progressively shorter as time goes on. You'll find yourself shying away from touchy subjects until there's very little left to sing about. If you believe in the artisitic vision of this lyric, then your question pretty much answers itself. If not, then maybe you're not being honest with yourself musically.

 

Basically I think that once you've asked yourself if you are satisfied with the song and the answer has come back yes, then it's your duty as an artist to present it to the public and be prepared to defend your artistic vision if necessary. I don't mean be militant or anything, but just be willing to stand up for the quality of your work. If you can't do that, then maybe the song isn't that important to you.

 

I fully understand where you're coming from with your question. There are certain subjects which just have not been addressed musically very often because they are so sensitive. This song strikes me as a rather effective and sensitive look at the subject. Good work.

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I definitely disagree with that guy above. Your song makes me want to kill myself.

 

But seriously, you have captured so much of how I feel. Let's look at it line by line.

 

Die Away Easy-by Archie McLeod III

 

Sometimes it's hard

 

(Yes. It needs to be. That's when I stroke it. Or are you talking about something else?)

 

And I feel like I wanna' give up

 

(But I don't. I mean, sure my arm is tired, but I didn't spend 15 minutes cutting off the circulation and numbing my hand for nothing.)

 

And I'm down to the last drop of coffee

In this big old coffe cup

Called life..........

 

(Good point! I can't even count all the people I know who think their lives are just one "big old coffee cup..." I hear it referred to that way all the time.)

 

And sometimes life just ain't fair (Yup)

 

People walking all around you

Like you're not even there

 

(How dare they not focus their attention on you? Don't they know how important you are?!?)

 

And I ain't never felt

Like I really belonged

Folks standing there listening but they never hear your song

 

(If they're way unlucky that is... Your song needs to be heard! You have something to say.)

 

And the more you cry out, the more they run and hide

They don't ever want to feel the pain and the hurt that you feel inside

 

(And for good reason, too. You, my friend, are a tortured artist, and nobody nobody in their right mind would want to shoulder your burden.)

 

Chorus:

 

That's why I wanna' lay down

And die away easy

 

(Yeah. It would suck to go out in an interesting way. If that happened, you might have to feel something, and you already have enough feelings.)

 

The damage done and it's all that I can do.

 

(well, don't sell yourself short.)

 

The fight ain't worth the battle and a change for me is due

 

(Yeah, dude. You deserve it.)

 

I wanna' die easy

 

Verse 2

 

Somewhere along the way

I lost touch with myself

 

(You don't call... you don't write... Do you even know if you're still there?)

 

Givin' way to the whims and the whines

Of everybody else

That I Love

 

(Why do you love them again? They're whiners. Not like you, though. You don't whine. You just take it like a man... whatever "it" is, I mean...)

 

But sometimes that love is not returned

Seems that after so long that's a lesson that I should have learned

 

(Who cares? You'll show them! Their lives will suck when you're gone. They'll see.)

 

Chorus

 

Verse 3

 

You say I sound like a cowardly man

Well maybe that's true

 

(Oh come on... Dying away easy? That's hard. Only someone brave could face a painless death at a convenient time.)

 

You've got your oppinions

(And I've got mine too)

But I've got the power to control my destiny

There ain't nothng you can do about it

It's All up to me

 

(You sound very effacatious. I wish I were so empowered. I would kill myself alot more often. Maybe this afternoon?)

 

I can definitely see why you are concerned. "It" gets me down all the time too, especially when it's hard. And then with everybody standing there not even listening to my song, I wonder why I keep living this big old coffee cup in the first place. Shiesh....

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I think your question is very valid and one that you must consider carefully. As a songwriter myself I would move forward cautiously if I had a song with a very one-sided presentation or treatment of a subject. Music is shared so your audience does and should determine to some extent the content of your songs. People have shown that they are not capable of separating the ideas in one song from the ideas of another. If you write one song saying life stinks, and another song saying life is great . . . any time an artist does this, fans cite confusion and bitterness toward the songwriter. I guess they aren't able to understand the idea of a song capturing a feeling--they only understand a song as representing the average feelings of an artist.

 

That said, I personally don't find your song potentially damaging or harmful, but I am not suicidal, so who knows.

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This also reminds me of the aftershocks of the Columbine tragedy. Marilyn Manson was blamed for this tragedy by many people and groups who believed he somehow played a part in the tragedy merely by writing dark songs.

 

I may be the only one to say this, but as a songwriter you can't just say "I wrote this song and it's about something in my life so don't take it so seriously" -- you have to expect that people will take your song seriously. If they resonate with the song at all, no matter what it's content, they will use it as justification of the way they feel, regardless even of misinterpretation.

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I used to wrestle with the very questions you are as far as lyric writing, J.O.S.

 

But ultimately, here's what you have to ask yourself:

Are you writing to reach a mass audience?

Are you writing to express feelings and ideas that can't be expressed in any other outlet?

 

If your answer is number one, then you pretty much limit yourself to writing "boy meets girl, boy loses girl, moon, june, spoon" kind of thing, because it's a proven fact that radio and mass media (with a few notable exceptions) steer clear of a song that has any other kind of subject line.

 

If your answer is number two, then write what you feel. Let whoever happens to hear it hang whatever shingle on it they will. History is littered with songs who's meaning was misinterpreted. ("Every Breath You Take" for example)

 

Worry about whether it's the socially responsible thing to do AFTER the record deal. Right now, you have only one responsibility...to express yourself.

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Seriously though... If I were you, I would worry about the quality of the song before I worried about social responsibility issues. Your song probably has some meaning to you because you wrote it and because you are the one that is possibly experiencing this deep psychological pain, but for everyone else (read: me), the lyrics are basically just hackneyed drivel. You haven't put a single meaningful image or detail in the song (unless you count the coffee cup, and I don't). It just goes on for verses, whining about some unnamed malady, and then you let everyone know that you wish you were dead but that you're too big a {censored} to kill yourself in any way that hurts.

 

Here's a suggestion: rewrite the song with some interesting content. Hell, you are probably cheating yourself out of about three or four good songs if you keep this one.

 

First, you could write about whatever it is that's actually causing you the heretofore unnamed pain. People are basically voyeurs and emotional vampires anyhow. They like tabloid headlines, and they like whatever it is that's making your life suck. So write that one first.

 

Second, write a song about all the ways you think up to kill yourself and the pros and cons to each. Treat it lightly and give the song an upbeat melody and nice, happy, major chords. The irony will bleed through, and people will like you for admitting that you have thought about packing it in. Everyone has. For example, I thought about jumping out my office window just yesterday morning, but I had too much work to do and it wasn't a convenient time. Plus, I would likely land atop my car, thereby decreasing the value of my estate.

 

Third, write a song about all the things you would do if you didn't have to worry about fitting in. I can only assume from the words of your song that you feel like a complete misfit. So, who would you date if you weren

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From the comments I've read by others in this thread, there seems to be a bit of a misunderstanding regarding the entire concept of social responsibility. There is a basic difference between standing up in a theater and yelling fire, and making a movie about standing up in a theater and yelling fire. One is the wrong thing to do, while the other is attempting to show artistically that this would be the wrong thing to do. Writing a song about depression and suicidal feelings IS socially responsible if your song makes the listeners think about the subject matter. That is ultimately the entire reason for the existence of creative endeavors...to make the audience think and feel certain things...and if you have made an artistic statement on a subject, then it is socially responsible to place it before the public so that it's relative value can be determined by society. Unfortunately, in today's world there are far too many who either can't or won't take the time to think about such creative endeavors, and then when something bad happens they respond with knee jerk reactions like blaming songs, or movies, or whatever art form they can latch onto for causing the aforementioned bad thing to happen instead of understanding that art in any form can't "make" someone do something.

 

Artists, musicians, and writers have been dealing with these kinds of dilemnas for as long as mankind has created art. If you feel you can make a relavent contribution to the societal discourse with a song, then not letting the world have the opportunity to listen does society a disservice. That's been the way of the artist throughout history, and for the most part it still is today, in spite of the rather large segment of society that seems to think that blame for anything bad that happens should be placed squarely at the feet of whoever they can point a finger at other than themselves.

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Originally posted by billsworld

From the comments I've read by others in this thread, there seems to be a bit of a misunderstanding regarding the entire concept of social responsibility. There is a basic difference between standing up in a theater and yelling fire, and making a movie about standing up in a theater and yelling fire. One is the wrong thing to do, while the other is attempting to show artistically that this would be the wrong thing to do. Writing a song about depression and suicidal feelings IS socially responsible if your song makes the listeners think about the subject matter. That is ultimately the entire reason for the existence of creative endeavors...to make the audience think and feel certain things...and if you have made an artistic statement on a subject, then it is socially responsible to place it before the public so that it's relative value can be determined by society.

 

 

Thanks alot professor. I'm sure everyone is well versed in all the reasons we write and create. And when you next appropriate the mental work of Oliver Wendell Holmes, I think it would be appropriate to mention his name.

 

My whole point is that it is silly to worry about nebulous and time-worn "social responsibility" issues when you haven't even written lyrics worth repeating. Songwriting, as part of the oral tradition, serves a useful purpose. It is a way of expressing emotion, true, but it is also a way of telling stories and relating experiences. Every topic under the sun has already been discussed in song, and you will never write anything original unless you inject something uniquely yours into the format. A history, a characterization of an interesting person, an experience you had when you were on drugs -- it could be anything. Without it, however, you have not provided the listener with anything worth their time. Everyone has problems, and unless yours are particularly interesting and you are willing to tell about them in a meaningful way, then no one wants to hear you complain. So, no one will listen, and all your concern about social responsibility is just a bunch of wanking. First write somehting worth listening to, and then worry about whether you are being responsible.

 

That is why I have not treated the social responsibility issue directly in my prior posts -- not because of some perceived misunderstanding.

 

Otherwise, I think you are quite right about the stuff you said.

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:) First of all, let me thank you guys for the responses thus far. (Some more than others) I truly believe as many have said here that in essence a song is an artistic expression and that being said, should be shared. My little ditty, as with so many other songs by greater and lesser writers shares a personal spin of situations that affect us at the moment and very true, many times these words might help someone not feel so alone-that someone else is feeling what they are feeling or even as with many blues songs; paint a picture that makes your situation seem better-an uplift so to speak. But I don't live in a fantasy land. In our society, you can and will be sued for even *my* song (if you are basing on masses of people listening-there are exactly 3100 persons on SoundClick alone that have heard it already since October 26) if they feel they can afix blame somehow to you. And even though no one that I am aware of has been successfully sued for liability in the use of a lyric as such, herein lies the fact that they "have" been sued. Legal representation cost money at any level.

 

EAD, you seem such the synic here. Your in-your-face approach almost completely mask the point of this post. You in essence speak from the issue that *you* feel no one will listen to this song from a mass-media perspective and "no one would even want to hear this drivel that says nothing new." I am probably amongst the many listener who also feel like a number of our young contemporaries say absolutely nothing in song that any rational, intelligent life form would want to hear either and I have not heard and absolutely "new idea" in 40 years! MTV, VH-1, BET, etc. don't play new anything. It's all recycled ideas with a different back beat or instrumentation to present an illusion of newness. I love for example the "sound" of the bands "Jet" and "The Darkness" but their music speaks nothing new at all. On the contrary, their music is the 70's at it's best. EAD, I think that you should be more cognetive of the fact that your points are your points and not even those of 10 % of todays society and most people survive and thrive on familiarity- we are all most comfortable with "familiar" please do not discount ones song writing abilities, subject matter or mass appeal by your personal oppinions. You made some mighty bold prententious oppinions based on your personal feelings; not popular oppinion.;)

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Yes, I am cynical.

 

That said, I think you can add something new to the canon. You just need to explore a little deeper to do so. We all necessarily have a unique perspective because our experiences are different. That is what you have to offer -- your perspective based on your unique experiences. If you leave the experiences out, however, you are just stating an unjustified opinion. In your case, the opinion is whiny, and therefore not palatable.

 

I think your lyrics are a very surface level treatment of a serious subject, and I think you could do much better. You just need to work harder and be more honest.

 

As for getting sued, you are smoking crack if you are worried about that. Yes, someone might sue you. No, they cannot win. You can beat them very cheaply, have the Court award you the costs and expenses of your trouble (which the other party should have to pay for filing a frivolous claim), and counterclaim for malicious prosecution. You'll come out ahead financially, and the press you can leverage off of a lawsuit like that would be priceless.

 

No Court would allow a jury to find that your song is the proximate cause of another person's suicide, and you will not be liable in tort or otherwise.

 

Back to the point at hand...Your song contains no interesting content. You just piss and moan without adding any justification for your feelings. That is not an opinion. That is a fact, and it is a true fact unless you want to say that "no one listening to your song" is your whole justification for wanting to die away easy. If so, I think that is pretty weak.

 

I encourage you to dig deeper and rewrite. Come back with something more visceral, and I will be excited for you.

 

P.S. I have not been able to access the recording of your song. Every time I click on the link, the server is down... or something.

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EAD I think you have a point that the lyrics could be stronger. They could. But it's also unfortunately true that only the writers care. Some songs connect with audiences despite their simplicity and unoriginality.

 

JoyOfSax take it for what it's worth. Your song could be better but stay true to yourself as a writer as you proceed in making it better. Early on when I was getting my creative writing degree I often felt like I was merely making my works more like the professors'. This was frustrating until I realized that the professors had valid advice, and that I could live up to that advice while remaining true to what I was trying to say. Once I achieved that balance my writing was much sharper and I could do more with less.

 

On the other side of that, when I started writing songs I made them very simple because IME people don't really seem to want to engage with a topic in a song. Also, the more vague your lyrics are the wider the audience is going to be who will connect to them. Someone above mentioned "Every Breath You Take," a threat song written from the point of view of a stalker, but which apparently has lyrics vague enough to be mistaken for a romantic love song.

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Originally posted by E.A.D.

Yes, I am cynical.


That said, I think you can add something new to the canon. You just need to explore a little deeper to do so. We all necessarily have a unique perspective because our experiences are different. That is what you have to offer -- your perspective based on your unique experiences. If you leave the experiences out, however, you are just stating an unjustified opinion. In your case, the opinion is whiny, and therefore not palatable.



Back to the point at hand...Your song contains no interesting content. You just piss and moan without adding any justification for your feelings. That is not an opinion. That is a fact, and it is a true fact unless you want to say that "no one listening to your song" is your whole justification for wanting to die away easy. If so, I think that is pretty weak.


 

EAD, I had a professor in college that reminds me of you. Everything had to have a deeper meaning than what was literally on the surface. The speech about being honest and truthful. Again, I say to you that is your oppinion and that is also your interpretation of the song. I believe that "you" wouldn't buy this or listen and that "you" feel that the song is whiny and not palatable. I find that statement very intresting as there have been far more people that have found the sentiment of the song far more palatable than those who didn't. Far more people seemed to relate to the song than don't.

 

"No one listening to your song" was a metaphor buy the way. (As was the last drop of coffee analogy) The song represented the image of ones life-the things you have to say, the agony and the joys you feel and how at that moment , no one seems to care. Whiny? No. I am a very concientious, caring type of person who loves to help others and do things that help the plight of mankind but every now and then, the fact that others aren't lifting a finger to help *me* in my times of need can wear you down. That's where that line came from. The whole song was about the feeling we all get sometimes (well maybe not you) when for all that we do, we don't get the same help in return and the lack of reciprocation really gets you down.

 

"The whims and the whins of everybody else......that I love" Parents, family, friends always need something; need you to do something but yet in your time of need you get nothing from them-they don't same to care and you have your share of hard knocks and the world weighs so heavy on you. You simply want peace to come. You want the pain to go away-you want someone to come to your rescue instead of the other way around. You feel like you are drowning and there is no life line. You simply want to "Lay Down and Die Away" This could be used to describe an emotional retreat from this world or a physical death. Either will suffice. That was the source of the song. If the words seem superificial at all which I really don't feel that they are; it's because a song writer has a choice to make. You can make a song an "ode" and it's length and complexity will definitely not make it a commercial success or you can use restraint, metaphoric relations to things that will allow you to hit the point home in that media friendly, 3:30 to 4:45 minute length that is more acceptable. This is what I did here. What I felt and put into words was a sentiment that I guarantee as you live and breath, everyone feels it and deals with it in different ways. For me the song was cathartic because at the time there was no one to share my pain with and the song did enlighten my emotions by releasing all this.

 

I think that is what creates a good song and also that is why (as another person stated on another forum) love songs seem to last forever-and songs that provide comforting sentiments are remembered long after the dance is over, the distorted guitar stops and the angry teenage angst of todays music is gone away. Just like you don't like my song, everyone doesn't like the unbrididled madness that has found it's way into much todays music. (Alice In Chains, Marilyn Manson-Staind, Slipknot, Hate-Breed and a few others) It's a matter of taste.

 

I'm sorry that was so long but I feel like I'm talking to well........I'll keep that to myself.;)

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E.A.D. you really crack me up man... that critique was pretty funny. and then JoyOfSax justifying his song was even better. it's what the songwriting forum really needs, this place gets boring.

 

sorry sax, im really not the type to rip on people's work, but if you are going to publicly display it, then expect the worst. you can keep saying that it is just EAD's point of view, or repeat some meaningless statistic from soundclick, but there is a real and perceiveable difference between art and a hack job. even if it's art you dont like. to me, this is typical lyrics or poetry from people who either dont try or dont know much about what makes good poetry or lyrics. im sorry i had to say that.

 

but hey, maybe your lyrics are exactly what you are after. some people like bland oatmeal i guess. if mass appeal is what you are after, id take EAD's advice about counter suing on a frivolus suit, but go proactive. make it even more "socially irresponcible". put some backwards talking in there and include something about abortion for the ultimate in shock value. you'll get some good press for that.

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Originally posted by Tangeric

there is a real and perceiveable difference between art and a hack job. even if it's art you dont like. to me, this is typical lyrics or poetry from people who either dont try or dont know much about what makes good poetry or lyrics. im sorry i had to say that.

 

 

I'm sure JoyOfSex forgives you. He doesn't post here anymore, because he gets more constructive "criticism" from his D&D friends, who like his work because they never even hear his song.

 

You, however, have discriminating taste in music and a keen ear for songwriting. As such, you have no excuse not to enter my contest listed in the thread "I Demand Satisfaction..."

 

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=781917

 

You were born to write homicidal lyrics. Now get to it.

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Hey JoyofSax-

 

I think the lyrics are good. To me, they do not need to have any social meaning or even longlasting personal meaning. When I write, it's usually what I feel at that particular moment. You hold no responisibility to anyone but yourself....

 

You're song kind has an Alice in Chains vibe to it, lyrically speaking.

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