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Lady Penelope

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  • #16






    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey Uncle
    View Post

    I'm not crazy about using 'hectic' as a noun, but I realize your rhyme choices are pretty limited.



    This phrase confused me: These tears of pride



    I get the second part of that line about seeing the fear behind the pride, but I can't figure out why being proud would make you cry.



    The chorus seems a little complex just reading it, but I can't wait to hear how it sounds over a great Lee Knight melody.














    Quote Originally Posted by grace_slick
    View Post

    Hmm...why would being proud make someone cry...



    Often pride for a loved one can be so overwhelming, it can bring on tears. And in terms of self-pride, tears can come from a more complicated place. Guilt mixed with pride, regret mixed with pride, the pressure of expectation and the resulting relief from feeling pride...stuff like that maybe.










    Quote Originally Posted by Oswlek
    View Post

    That is exactly what I was thinking. I actually thought it was a great line, full of complex emotion in few words.










    Quote Originally Posted by stickboymusic
    View Post

    I think the "heroes are dead" line is a bit out of place



    How about



    You're not a little girl, I'm not your daddy

    There is no Superman, Lady Penelope

    The world's a better place to live

    When we beg, borrow and give

    Here's the deal, our heroes aren't real, Lady Penelope




    hectic



    tears of pride



    our heroes are dead



    Great stuff, guys. The use of hectic as a noun. I don't know, I sorta like it. A modern language trend is to verbafy nouns. Journaling. Google it. The horrible "I God you". "Guilt me into it." So adjective as noun...





    'The intelligent are not arrogant'

    Thomas Jefferson said... "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." hmmm...

    Comment


    • #17
      <day-to-day> took me a couple times to climb that hill. Then I went "Aha."



      Truly love:

      And when our world starts to crumble, logic turns to jumble

      "I love you's" turn to mumble, I still love you




      There's your boat anchor. Doesn't need to be in the chorus. But it needs to be in there like you got it. Well done.



      I read your explanation. That's pretty much what I figured was going on, though I'm not familiar with the Thunderbirds and Lady Penelope. Don't need to be. the song speaks for itself.



      Well done.
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGxDwt26FZc
      http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/marshallsongs
      http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/marshallsongs

      Comment


      • #18
        You're not a little girl, I'm not your daddy

        There is no Superman, Lady Penelope

        The world's a better place to live

        When we beg, borrow and give

        Our heroes are long gone, wake up with the dawn, Lady Penelope
        Thomas Jefferson said... "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." hmmm...

        Comment


        • #19






          Quote Originally Posted by Lee Knight
          View Post

          . . . ,

          our heroes are dead



          It is a bit "God is dead-ish". Nietzsche said that, and then, "Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?" The murdering of God. I take "Our heroes are dead", to mean, ain't nobody gonna do it for you now. I'm not your dad, I'm not superman, if if either ever existed, they're gone now, leaving only the fact that you... must do what you... want and need done. Lady Penelope was a game, fun. This is real and there is no aristocrat waiting to take you to the next fashion show in Milan. . . . ,




          Got that too. Nice explanation, though. But I figured that's what was behind it. Dead nuts on !
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGxDwt26FZc
          http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/marshallsongs
          http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/marshallsongs

          Comment


          • #20






            Quote Originally Posted by Lee Knight
            View Post

            You're not a little girl, I'm not your daddy

            There is no Superman, Lady Penelope

            The world's a better place to live

            When we beg, borrow and give

            Our heroes are long gone, wake up with the dawn, Lady Penelope




            Hhhhmmmm. I'm not sue I would go with wake up with the dawn. Seems unecessary and degenerative. Our heroes are long gone already says that. Maybe I'm just familiar with the first read (and get it) and don't want to see stuff just stuck in there. I mean it works. Just seems redundant to a fault. (cliche like?)
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGxDwt26FZc
            http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/marshallsongs
            http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/marshallsongs

            Comment


            • #21
              yeah... ^^^ cliche for sure. I'm glad I have it in the back pocket though. I might need that come melody time. Some sort of hope in all the harsh reality. But yeah, I hear you and will be happy not to use it.
              Thomas Jefferson said... "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." hmmm...

              Comment


              • #22






                Quote Originally Posted by Lee Knight
                View Post

                our heroes are dead



                Stick says: Here's the deal, our heroes aren't real,




                Hmm...heroes are dead or heroes aren't real...?



                I like the flow of "aren't real", but...is it enough to have that specific meaning over the original meaning intended by "dead"? Cause dead, as has been said above, implies they were at some stage in existence and believed in and relied upon for whatever purpose. And so now they're dead, it's like a dream has been shattered, a comfort has been removed. The word "dead" is quite blunt. Like if someone's died and you're told about it, "(insert name)'s dead" is much harsher and more shocking than "(insert name) has died". So yeah, because of the bluntness of the word "dead", to me it's like ripping away the dreams of the person you're telling her heroes are not there. They're dead. Gone. You're on your own.



                Whereas heroes aren't real...it doesn't have the same impact, and it doesn't have the same meaning. Yeah, your heroes aren't real, they never were, they never existed except within your mind.



                I don't know what I'm blabbering about now. I shall go. lol
                All things must pass...

                Comment


                • #23






                  Quote Originally Posted by grace_slick
                  View Post

                  Hmm...heroes are dead or heroes aren't real...?



                  I like the flow of "aren't real", but...is it enough to have that specific meaning over the original meaning intended by "dead"? Cause dead, as has been said above, implies they were at some stage in existence and believed in and relied upon for whatever purpose. And so now they're dead, it's like a dream has been shattered, a comfort has been removed. The word "dead" is quite blunt. Like if someone's died and you're told about it, "(insert name)'s dead" is much harsher and more shocking than "(insert name) has died". So yeah, because of the bluntness of the word "dead", to me it's like ripping away the dreams of the person you're telling her heroes are not there. They're dead. Gone. You're on your own.



                  Whereas heroes aren't real...it doesn't have the same impact, and it doesn't have the same meaning. Yeah, your heroes aren't real, they never were, they never existed except within your mind.



                  I don't know what I'm blabbering about now. I shall go. lol




                  +1.
                  Beware of deepities.<br>-- Daniel Dennett

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Thank you!
                    All things must pass...

                    Comment


                    • #25






                      Quote Originally Posted by grace_slick
                      View Post

                      Hmm...heroes are dead or heroes aren't real...?



                      I like the flow of "aren't real", but...is it enough to have that specific meaning over the original meaning intended by "dead"? Cause dead, as has been said above, implies they were at some stage in existence and believed in and relied upon for whatever purpose. And so now they're dead, it's like a dream has been shattered, a comfort has been removed. The word "dead" is quite blunt. Like if someone's died and you're told about it, "(insert name)'s dead" is much harsher and more shocking than "(insert name) has died". So yeah, because of the bluntness of the word "dead", to me it's like ripping away the dreams of the person you're telling her heroes are not there. They're dead. Gone. You're on your own.



                      Whereas heroes aren't real...it doesn't have the same impact, and it doesn't have the same meaning. Yeah, your heroes aren't real, they never were, they never existed except within your mind.




                      Thomas Jefferson said... "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." hmmm...

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        I'm liking where you are with the chorus.



                        Here are 2 thoughts :



                        1. Maybe leave out 'little' - it may be difficult to sing, and it is implied in the overall sentence.

                        2. 'Long gone' is strong - why not repeat it?



                        You're not a girl, I'm not your daddy

                        There is no Superman, Lady Penelope

                        The world's a better place to live

                        When we beg, borrow and give

                        Our heroes are long gone

                        Long gone, Lady Penelope
                        'Music is your own experience, your thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn'.
                        CHARLIE PARKER

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Is the below in keeping with the song?



                          You're not a girl, I'm not your daddy

                          There is no Superman, Lady Penelope

                          The world's a better place to live

                          When we beg, borrow and give

                          Our heroes are long gone

                          FAREWELL, Lady Penelope

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Two lines in the chorus have been bugging me since first read, but it took me until now to figure out why.



                            The world's a better place to live

                            When we beg, borrow and give




                            My gut reaction is 'non-sequitur.' Why are we suddenly talking about making the world a better place in the middle of an intimate song about a tense relationship between two people? After mulling it over, I do get what you're going for - we're better off when we do things ourselves, by whatever means necessary, than when we rely on some idolized hero to save us. But I had to think about it to get there. I'd look for some words that express this sentiment in terms that involve just the narrator and Lady Penelope.



                            Does that make sense?
                            Beware of deepities.<br>-- Daniel Dennett

                            Comment


                            • #29






                              Quote Originally Posted by grace_slick
                              View Post

                              So yeah, because of the bluntness of the word "dead", to me it's like ripping away the dreams of the person you're telling her heroes are not there. They're dead. Gone. You're on your own.




                              That was good.
                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGxDwt26FZc
                              http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/marshallsongs
                              http://www.reverbnation.com/#!/marshallsongs

                              Comment


                              • #30






                                Quote Originally Posted by Monkey Uncle
                                View Post

                                Two lines in the chorus have been bugging me since first read, but it took me until now to figure out why.



                                The world's a better place to live

                                When we beg, borrow and give




                                My gut reaction is 'non-sequitur.' Why are we suddenly talking about making the world a better place in the middle of an intimate song about a tense relationship between two people? After mulling it over, I do get what you're going for - we're better off when we do things ourselves, by whatever means necessary, than when we rely on some idolized hero to save us. But I had to think about it to get there. I'd look for some words that express this sentiment in terms that involve just the narrator and Lady Penelope.



                                Does that make sense?




                                Wow! That's uncanny. Almost to the word you've described the issue I've had with those lines as well. I like the lines too. But I absolutely agree. The listener, I don't believe, does not walk away getting the meaning. It's too cryptic for its own good.



                                And with that input, ^right there^, it makes me want to step back and regroup. To then focus on clarity of meaning and communicating it. Thanks MU. Very good stuff.
                                Thomas Jefferson said... "The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." hmmm...

                                Comment



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