Snare tuning experiment

[rayboomboom]

My best/worst critic is my GF. So often she says she doesn't like the lack of low end when I play, including playing on someone else's kit, that, of course I have very little control over. The biggest issue she says is the snare. I play allot of shuffles using the Chicago style and on snare drums that are cranked up tight it really sounds pretty thin. I've been working on loosening the top head in the past few months but she has said it could still use more bottom. So I had a Blues gig a couple of weekends ago and tried re-tuning both the bottom and top heads. Also playing with the snare wire tension.

 

It has taken some getting used to but I'm really liking the lower tuning. I'm so used to having a short pop with a bit or ring. Now it's a little more beefy, more snare sound and lots of body. I'm playing a Tama Star Classic birch, split 16 lug snare with die cast hoops. The top head is an Evans ST dry and a Remo Ambassador (I think) on the bottom. Puresound brass snares.

 

The best part is the GF says it sounds great!

 

I'm really pretty tired of the timbale sounding snares that has been getting progressively higher pitch over the last decade or so. I think it takes way more tuning experience and technical know-how to tune a drum lower and give it body, including bass drums. I try to get as good a tone possible with my kick using very little muffling.

 

So what do you folks think of any of this?

[1001gear]

I like the sustain you get with medium / medium high tuning and the tss tss sound when you tap the head. Good for loud ghost notes and even "4 on the snare" shuffles where you basically tap bass ride and snare on all the beats. It doesn't seem to take a deep drum either. I just played a 5.5 tuned like that.- very dry but ballsy sound. Gretsches do that sound well. I think it's the rounded edges more than anything.

Thinking about it, a snare that went from that to standard rock crack on a lever would be molto cool.

[WRGKMC]

I just bought a new set of heads for my studio set. I'm not much of a drummer but I can tune them pretty good. My drummer and I put them on before a session just using a torque wrench and just a quick adjustment before recording and it sounded awful. None of the mics were disturbed in this process so I had A/B comparisons of before and after.

 

What I wound up doing is using my drum machine as an A/B comparison for tuning. Its much like taking a guitar string and tuning it to a piano note except its s drum sample. I found the kind of drum tones I wanted then I just tapped the trigger and matched the drum tuning. The key is getting the snare in the right range so its not masked by other midrange instruments like the vocals or guitars and then it will stand out nicely in a mix. A snare may sound too high in comparison to the rest of the set if the other drums are tuned too low, or vice versa.

 

If you can get the kick to match the bass range and snare between the Vocals and guitar the rest of the drums seem to fall in place fairly easily.

 

I went back to having top and bottom heads which does make the task more difficult. Like I said I'm no great drummer and I'm used to hearing the set out front but with them miced and using headphones I think I got them fairly well matched.

 

I'm probably going to record again this week end and see how it worked out. I'll be able to hear the drums from the outside too and possibly find some other faults that need to be tweaked.

 

 

[cdawg]

there's a reason for any flavor, imo. but, for the most part, i tune about in the middle.

 

i have a 12" main snare i tune pretty low (but not so low that i get muddy ghost notes.

my 14" i tune higher for better rebound.

 

depending on depth, you can get all kinds of tunings you wouldn't expect. in fact, that's how that 12" ended up being my main. it's 7" deep and is NOT timbale sounding at all. holds different tunings pretty well, imo.

[FitchFY]

I love that different drums have different voices, and the heads and shells have a huge impact on that sound. My primary snare is more of a crack and defined ghost note drum, which fits the music I use it for. I do, however, use a Ludwig Black Galaxy I rebuilt which has a much deeper and throaty sound to it. It really is all about the musical application and matching the right drum to the right band and style.

[rayboomboom]

I agree with matching the sound to the style of music. I do believe that some have taken it a bit too far with the tight snare, and in the past my self included.

 

Also, just to clarify, I'm not going for the muddy thud. I can still articulate ghost notes nicely. That's a must! So I may be really tuning in the mid range of the spectrum. But to me it's down there pretty far from where my old comfort level was.

[rayboomboom]

 

i have a 12" main snare i tune pretty low (but not so low that i get muddy ghost notes.

my 14" i tune higher for better rebound.

 

depending on depth, you can get all kinds of tunings you wouldn't expect. in fact, that's how that 12" ended up being my main. it's 7" deep and is NOT timbale sounding at all. holds different tunings pretty well, imo.

 

I also have a 12" Premier snare. I think it's about 5.5" to 6" deep. I've tried some different tunings on it and I'm surprised at how low it can go. The Tama just has a wider tuning range and overall sounds really nice where ever I put it. It's been the best snare I've owned.

[rayboomboom]

Now I have to add to the equation. How much do you guys think the difference between brass and metal snare change the pitch of the drum?

 

edit: not the pitch really but I guess the brightness. You could say the perception of the pitch.

[1001gear]

Obviously a metal drum can get clangier than wood but there's enough overlap, aging heads withstanding, where the differences blur. For example, you may be able to pick your drum out of a lineup but not be able to pin down the other drums.

 

[cdawg]

i agree.

 

personally, i find a lot of metal snares too ringy. i should note i haven't played brass so much. i have a metal snare that i didn't like, did some mods and it sounds pretty damn good now. by far, the best metal snare i've ever played was copper.

 

bottom line is, i'm stuck in the cheap snare world. my 12" is a premier too, i think i paid about $150.

[WRGKMC]

I'd say a metal snare does tend to sound bright and to ring more. Those two items can be good or bad depending on what you need and how it mixes with the rest of the set, cymbal types etc. Wood tends to vary allot more then metal. I suppose there's less bleed from the side of the snare and what does get through sounds darker. I usually mic the snare from the side so I get an even blend of top and bottom heads and there's less high hat bleed into the snare mic.

 

What I hear mixing with a wood snare contains a warmer thud as an initial transient. The steel has more metallic tone for sure. If I miced the snare from top and or bottom I probably wouldn't be getting those different shades like I would from the side. My buddy was using his wood DW snare for about a year doing recordings I can compare those recordings to ones done with the steel snare and they sound very different. I'm back to using the steel snare and it has been rough getting good recordings from it. I have to do allot more work with an EQ in comparison to the wood snare to get rid of unwanted overtones, but for some loud rock stuff a steel snare can kick butt cutting through a mix.

 

 

[Drumstix101]

I tend to be a metal snare guy. I have a 14 x 5 Supra that I have been playing since '67. This was my go to snare for almost all of my playing; choosing it over two wood snares that I also have. However about three years ago I got a Black Magic 14 x 6.5 and I started using it a little more than the Supra. The thin brass shell had a sound that seemed brighter to my ears than the supra. I did tune the Black Magic lower than the supra but for some reason the drum seems more responsive than the Supra so it became my go to snare for rock music and larger venues where I want more volume out of the snare. I would choose the Supra for blues or Zydeco gigs because the aluminum shell really give me a great sound on a rim shot and the drum just sounds better to my ears when playing Blues or Zydeco.

This past May I bought a Ludwig Venus that is a 14 x 3.7 that has a very thick brass shell. This drum is the heaviest snare that I have ever owned and it is also the shallowest. I find this drum to be the most responsive of all of my drums. It is also tuned the highest. Surprisingly, while this drum is the loudest of all the drums I own I always grab it for low volume playing. rods or brushed have great articulation and it's easy to play super quiet with light sticks and still get ghost notes. Also side sticking is very crisp.

All 3 of my metal snares have the same heads and snares; G1 coated over Hazy 200's with Puresound 20 strand blasters so I know that I am comparing apples to apples.

In my opinion brass shells seem brighter than aluminum and I tend to believe that shell thickness plays just as big a part in drum volume as depth does.

While I like brass or aluminum snare drums I have played a few steel drums and in my opinion they all sounded like crap. Given the choice between a cheap poplar wood shell or steel I'll take the poplar any day of the week.

[cdawg]

i agree with the steel drums sounding like crap. mine is a yamaha that came with my lower level kit when i was 16. 14x6.5, or something. anyway, i never played it and was gonna scrap it until i decided to mod it. it made it a new drum.

 

forgive me, old guys, who have heard this story before.

 

anyway, i stripped the drum and painted the inside with a full can of that spray rubber stuff. it worked very well. it still sounds like a steel drum, but the ring has been cut considerably. since then, i've found crap snares like that at flea markets, etc, for $5 or so and applied the same treatment. so, basically, for about $15/drum, i've made really nice sounding drums, and sold them for about $40-$60 per drum. not bad return.

[1001gear]

Ballpark examples of the medium sound.

 

[video=youtube;r9V3v3n1SZU]

 

[video=youtube;HTylbqgGTJ8]

 

And some Gavin Harrison / spam with a couple good sounding, well tuned drums.

 

[video=youtube;s_8zsm4UHV4]

[fusionfunk]

I tend to lean toward the higher side of tuning, but medium works well too, depending on the music.

I normally prefer wood snare drums, but I still do, or have in the past used metal snare drums. The 3 that I like are my 5" X 14" Trick, which is machined aluminum, a 6.5" X 14" hammered Black Beauty with a P-70 super sensitive strainer, and a 6.5" X 14" Pearl Free Floater with a tympani copper shell.

 

I typically avoid steel shells like the plague.

[rayboomboom]

Okay I opened a really nice can of worms to work with. BUT I my question was actually about snare wires. My fault for not being specific. So I'll ask again.

 

How much do you guys think the difference between brass and metal snare wires affect the brightness or even the pitch of a drum?

[Drumstix101]

I have never used brass wires so I can't comment on them. However I don't think that there will be a pitch change. Pitch comes from drum size and head tension. I think that brass wires will not produce as crisp a sound as steel. Brass snare wires are relatively inexpensive; 14" 24 strand Puresound Custom Pro brass wires are $15 so you could experiment and then let us all know your findings!

[fusionfunk]

Over the many years I've been playing, I have used snare wires made out of steel, brass, bronze, and gut. As previously mentioned, it will not have an affect on pitch, but it will affect the tone. Brass and bronze tend to be warmer than steel, in my opinion, but that is under the microscope known as a recording studio. General playing and live playing, I don't think it's as noticeable.

[cdawg]

the only thing i can add is you get what you pay for. i needed wires once and sprung for the good ones. man, what a difference it made from the stock steel wires. much more pronounced and sensitive. it feels like robbery to pay 25-30 bucks for a set, but imo, it's worth it.